Thai director Nontawat Numbenchapol was born in 1983 in Bangkok. After graduating in Visual Communication at Rangsit University in Pathum Thani, Numbenchapol worked on numerous projects as still photographer and cinematographer. His work as a photographer was part of many exhibitions in his home country and abroad. In Thailand, he had worked with directors such as Paween Puritpanya and Apichatpong Weerasethakul.
Numbenchapol’s documentaries deal with issues such as history, identity and borders between people. “Boundary” and “By the River”, both released in 2013, were featured in international festivals and have received much praise. We speak with him about the path that led him to filmmaking, the conflict between Thailand and Cambodia, his approach to the medium, his motivation as an artist and his future projects.
How would you define your approach to filmmaking and documentaries?
I never dreamed of being a documentary filmmaker. But when I was young I went to the university and studied graphic design, but this was really boring to study. And then I wanted to make films at that time, but I did not know how to do it. At the time, a close friend of mine who is a skateboarder, has been recording, over the years, along with his friends, much footage by themselves. And I had the idea to use that footage in one of my films. So, everything I learned is from that time and every time I tried to make a feature film, it is not good, so I rather make a documentary.
So when I grew up I planned to make my first feature documentary “Boundary” and it was then I decided it was time to decide what my style, my approach was going to be like, in terms of visuals and editing.
You said the overall production of “Boundary” took over three years. Given the subject of the film, was the shooting process dangerous or difficult even?
I am not sure about dangerous, but when I made the film I was interested in the border between Thailand and Cambodia and the political conflict, especially in Bangkok. When I was young I have never been interested in political issues, but when I was living in Bangkok the conflict affected me, I became aware of the two sides of it. I started to read many books about the issue and to research about Thailand’s political history. And then, one day, the Thai soldiers shot almost 100 protesters on the street, by the government’s order. I was completely shocked by the situation, especially when some of my closest friends supported these acts, so I wanted to know more about the situation, what happened in reality and between people.
And then I met a young soldier who was ordered to shoot a number of protesters. He had gone through “real” situations, not like me sitting at my computer and on the internet. He had been sent to the south of the country and with him, I could feel something human: he never wanted to kill anyone, but this had been an order by the government. When he mentioned he would return to his village close to the border, to his family, I asked if if he wanted to be part of my documentary and he agreed. I stayed with him for two or three weeks.
During that time, I heard about ongoing fights between the Thai and the Cambodian government regarding Preah Vihear Temple and so I shaped my story around this area and its people. And this was a bit dangerous, because I heard about people who had died in that fight, houses were burnt and people had to move out of the town due to that. I was worried a war would break out between the two sides.
Up to that time, I had only been talking to Thai villagers and I felt if I only have the Thai side to the story, it might not look good. So I wanted to cross the border over to Cambodia, but because of the conflict I could not go. I tried to get someone to take me over, but no one would do it. I tried looking for Cambodians wiling to take me across the border and shoot over there, but they also did not want to take me. So I spend a year looking and finally my producer Davy Chou helped my to find someone.
I was lucky because Davy knew someone, a girl, who studied in New York, whose hometown was near Preah Vihear Temple. She wanted to help me, because she wanted to let Thai people know what happened on their side of the border, and she also told me I could not tell anyone over there I am Thai, I should pretend I am one of her friends from New York. This helped, because the Cambodians living in her village were really nice to me, took me anywhere and told me what happened on their side of the border. But I did not want to stay for more than a week, because I started feeling guilty when they told me their stories about the conflict.
When “Boundary” was finished and had premiered in Berlin, I tried to bring it to Thailand for a screening. But I never expected what would happen next, because the Thai government censored my film and later banned it. I realized how difficult it is to talk about political issues like this and I posted about what had happened on my Facebook account. When I woke up the next morning 2000 people had shared my post, more than one million people commented on my post and many newspapers – not one from Thailand – , for example from Italy, called me for an interview. Three days later they cancelled the ban, but asked me to delete two scenes from the film which were three or four seconds long. The first shows a place where Thai soldiers had died. The other one was showing part of the New Year Celebration.
Since this would not hurt the topic of the film I re-edited the movie, and also I had been worried about something else. In Thailand, according to the law, criticizing the government or the King could mean going to jail for five to ten years. So eventually I changed the film and it could be screened in Thailand. However, when people, especially in cities like Bangkok saw the film, they sometimes were a bit angry and did not want to talk with me afterwards anymore.
So I guess your film actually surpassed the boundaries of the government in some way. That’s great.
There is this impressive long take of a long drive with the eye of the camera shielded behind the car window. Can you give us some details about this scene? Is there anyway to overcome this boundary?
When I was shooting the film, I tried to put many boundaries within the film, not only the space, but also objects like the windows of a car. Outside you can see many things like birth and death, happy and sad faces, kids and old people or the new and the past year. There are many boundaries in my film.
I think in human life, boundaries are not there at first, and as time goes by they help to organize things which is important, but can also cause a lot of trouble. In the end, we learn to live with these boundaries in our lives.
In your opinion, can films and documentaries make a change in the world?
I think in some cases this is true, but for me that is not the most important aspect. In my films I am mostly looking for an answer to my question. And when people see my film, I hope they get to know something new, learn something, like me when I make these films.
Every time I make a documentary I learn something new about people, about places and about history. Then, I can survive understanding something better and I hope an audience can do the same. When I made “By the River,” the film helped the village and the people living there a bit, especially when I screened it in that village and invited a lot of media outlets. In this case it may help their case, can make their lives better. So sometimes, a film can help make a change.
Both of your films depict a society or people that have been destabilized in a way, yet at the same time, especially in “By the River”, they maintain a sense of harmony even though it may be lost. In what way is your work about trauma and overcoming it?
In many documentaries, the people you see are often under pressure or are in some kind of trouble. But for my way of making documentaries I try to understand them, look at them from a human perspective, even if I cannot really help them. Sometimes I help them see something beautiful in their lives rather than the sadness or the sorrows.
In your statement regarding “By the River,” you say if the film can do anything, it is to create awareness, yet at the same time you claim your film represents a “neutral view”. Is there such a thing a a neutral view in film?
Sometimes, when I shoot a documentary like “By the River” I put the camera on record and I walk out for 10 or 15 minutes. I also do not like to use voice-over that much in my films, but in the case of “Boundary” I had to when I had the feeling something was not made clear or was confusing. With “By the River” I did not have to use it at all.
Creating awareness for me happens during the editing process, when the film is put together. And eventually, when the film is screened to an audience.
Both your films also show a wide gap between rural and urban Thailand in terms of politics, awareness of the other and social structures. How visible is this gap in real life?
My home country Thailand is still a developing country because many people have come to Bangkok over the years and stay there for most of their lives. They do not care much for the surrounding areas or the other Thai provinces, they do not realize there is a difference between their lives and the ones of those in rural areas. Shooting “Boundary” really opened my eyes, made me realize Thailand is not only Bangkok and many problems happen in my country, and these issues are the ones I want Thai people to know about.
On a technical level, did you have a plan when it came to eventually structuring and editing “By the River” and “Boundary” because both films are quite different in terms of structure?
As I said before, when I make a documentary I try to bring different techniques to the project. For “Boundary”, as my first feature, I had no specific plan which is why it took so long to make the film and edit it. I improvised and had many problems during editing, because the film shifts between spaces and people, and also because I did not want to use voice over too much. Eventually, I used a lot of a the interviews as well as captions.
“By the River” was different because I decided to shoot in a small village and I decided to set up the characters very clearly before shooting. Even though I still had to use captions, I also developed my style in this film.
At last, what are your plans for the future? Do you have any project you are currently working on?
I think you have heard about my new project called “#BKKY”. For this one, I have interviewed over 100 Thai teenagers in Bangkok, who have never heard of my films, and edited them together. I want to try and make teenagers in Thailand watch my films and ,therefore, change, in terms of style.
Additionally, I have started researching about the Thai border in the north to Myanmar, about the problems of ethnic minorities over there who have been through conflicts with soldiers from Myanmar and both governments. At the moment, we are shooting inside a military training camp in which soldiers, mostly coming from these minorities, fight the Myanmar army.
Are you talking about the Ronhingya, a refugee group and Muslim minority in Thailand and Myanmar?
In Myanmar there are over 100 ethnic minorities and the Rohingya is just one of them. People like them have been through a lot of suffering and feel no one really cares about them and so I would like the world to know about them and their struggles.
Before we come to the end, could you tell me something about the Thai film industry? How is the situation at the moment? What kind of films does the general public like to watch?
For independent and documentary filmmaking the situation is certainly better than ten years ago, especially after directors like Apichatong Weerasethkul began releasing their films. Of course, the mainstream, popcorn cinema still has a lot bigger audience and bigger budgets to make its films. Independent filmmakers still have to rely largely on government funding. Most of the time, screening a film at an international festival is better for an independent film than releasing in Thailand which has only got a limited amount of cinemas showing them.
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